Final Fantasy VII Remake: “It’s Happening,” Insider Says

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Final Fantasy VII Remake: “It’s Happening,” Insider Says

Post by BigBox on Sat Feb 22, 2014 8:23 pm

I think the project is fake, the game would require too many changes in order to be relevant in the market.  The classic turn-based is an obsolete play-style especially on console games.  I think the only way for this to work in a modern setting is if they released it with the gameplay they have been doing with, Final Fantasy as of recent like in, Lightning Returns, and Final Fantasy XV.
http://www.dualshockers.com/2014/02/22/final-fantasy-vii-remake-its-happening-insider-says/
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Re: Final Fantasy VII Remake: “It’s Happening,” Insider Says

Post by DP on Sat Feb 22, 2014 8:42 pm

Fanboys don't care how outdated a game is, they'll buy it several times if it comes out broken. Though Square HAS commented before saying if they did do a VII remake, it'd be an updated version all around because VII is really broken in some ways.
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Re: Final Fantasy VII Remake: “It’s Happening,” Insider Says

Post by BigBox on Sat Feb 22, 2014 8:44 pm

I know what you mean, the game was great game for it's time and defined the genre for that generation.  However, after replaying it I noticed how broken the game was and how much of it needs to be revamped.  Which is everything in today's gaming.
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Re: Final Fantasy VII Remake: “It’s Happening,” Insider Says

Post by DP on Sat Feb 22, 2014 9:12 pm

For non-fans or just series fans, it definitely needs an update. (If they've given I-VI unnecessary updates, then a needed one is likely.) But even if Square just updated the textures, it'd sell like hotcakes because VII is one of the two most overrated games of all time. That game is the reason Square could literally shit in a box, slap a "Final Fantasy" on the title, and let it sell out the ass.
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Re: Final Fantasy VII Remake: “It’s Happening,” Insider Says

Post by BigBox on Sat Feb 22, 2014 9:36 pm

DP wrote:For non-fans or just series fans, it definitely needs an update. (If they've given I-VI unnecessary updates, then a needed one is likely.) But even if Square just updated the textures, it'd sell like hotcakes because VII is one of the two most overrated games of all time. That game is the reason Square could literally shit in a box, slap a "Final Fantasy" on the title, and let it sell out the ass.
 hurr 

Anyway, I know that fanboys/girls will buy it, play it and love it in all of it's poorly aged "glory" as they would call it.  Every Final Fantasy on PSOne and every game before it is an example of a game that needs updated if they're going to release it on a modern console  I'm not sure if we're agreeing, or disagree, but Final Fantasy VII is in need of an update.  Also, I don't find the last part to be true as Final Fantasy was already a house hold name when FFVII came out.  In fact, Final Fantasy I is the reason Squaresoft is still a company.  I would say, Final Fantasy I is the reason they can do the last part.
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Re: Final Fantasy VII Remake: “It’s Happening,” Insider Says

Post by this_is_marko on Sat Feb 22, 2014 9:57 pm

Anaconda_Vice wrote:The classic turn-based is an obsolete play-style especially on console games. 

I actually really enjoy turn-based games
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Re: Final Fantasy VII Remake: “It’s Happening,” Insider Says

Post by BigBox on Sat Feb 22, 2014 10:05 pm

this_is_marko wrote:
Anaconda_Vice wrote:The classic turn-based is an obsolete play-style especially on console games. 

I actually really enjoy turn-based games
I'm sure you can agree that the style is obsolete regardless of enjoyment.
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Re: Final Fantasy VII Remake: “It’s Happening,” Insider Says

Post by DP on Sat Feb 22, 2014 10:21 pm

Yeah, FFI was what kept Square alive essentially, but VII was another beast entirely. It took a massive step backwards on a technical level (bar the 3D, natch), but it was rewarded for it via the insane sales figures worldwide (as opposed to Japan and a more or less niche market in the US). It was the DBZ of JRPGs: There was good shit that hit the US before it, but that is what REALLY opened the door to a whole new audience of people who previously didn't play the genre.

And I completely agree that it needs an update if it is gonna be rereleased. My point is that it doesn't have to have one for it to gain 3+ million quick sales, but that Square is likely to touch a lot of stuff based on past history with rereleases.

And turn-based is only obsolete if done obsoletely. There are some fantastic recent games that use the style (though admittedly, I can't recall one that was a JRPG - because there were only a few notable JRPGs in the past few years).
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Re: Final Fantasy VII Remake: “It’s Happening,” Insider Says

Post by dragonfire111 on Sat Feb 22, 2014 10:23 pm

DP wrote:For non-fans or just series fans, it definitely needs an update. (If they've given I-VI unnecessary updates, then a needed one is likely.) But even if Square just updated the textures, it'd sell like hotcakes because VII is one of the two most overrated games of all time. That game is the reason Square could literally shit in a box, slap a "Final Fantasy" on the title, and let it sell out the ass.
but they did that already :P
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Re: Final Fantasy VII Remake: “It’s Happening,” Insider Says

Post by shikiyakumo on Sat Feb 22, 2014 10:34 pm

HAAWHAAWHAAW
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Re: Final Fantasy VII Remake: “It’s Happening,” Insider Says

Post by BigBox on Sat Feb 22, 2014 10:37 pm

dragonfire111 wrote:
DP wrote:For non-fans or just series fans, it definitely needs an update. (If they've given I-VI unnecessary updates, then a needed one is likely.) But even if Square just updated the textures, it'd sell like hotcakes because VII is one of the two most overrated games of all time. That game is the reason Square could literally shit in a box, slap a "Final Fantasy" on the title, and let it sell out the ass.
but they did that already :P
They started doing it sooner than that one.


You get the idea.
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Re: Final Fantasy VII Remake: “It’s Happening,” Insider Says

Post by dragonfire111 on Sat Feb 22, 2014 10:52 pm

oh and if turn based is outdated how is pokemon so popular
though i must say my favorite versions of turn based rpgs are the reaction type (like paper mario) and strategic map style (like fire emblem)
and the ironic thing about FF7 aging badly its predecessor FF6 (and chrono trigger as well but thats not FF) has aged quite well even the sprites still look great
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Re: Final Fantasy VII Remake: “It’s Happening,” Insider Says

Post by Count Mario on Sat Feb 22, 2014 11:08 pm

To be fair, Dragon, Pokemon is freaking Pokemon. Just think about it.
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Re: Final Fantasy VII Remake: “It’s Happening,” Insider Says

Post by Chaosdreams on Sat Feb 22, 2014 11:23 pm

Count Mario wrote:To be fair, Dragon, Pokemon is freaking Pokemon. Just think about it.

Merely a name attached to a style of gaming, turn-based in my opinion is a fantastic format. I'd like to see it come back in a few games, revamped of course, but I prefer it over the style that X-2 had, or 13 in regards to final fantasy.

Focusing on Pokemon, I'd say it's turn-based format is dull in comparison to what other games have had. Now, it's more polished considering it's most recent release (by polished, I mean up to date, enjoyable, looks pretty.) However, games such as FFX or Xenosaga had more complexity, much more (stats - more players used during the turn-based format.)

*shrugs* I don't really feel bad about a style of gaming disappearing though. It's nice to see it return in some games, or even last and be the definition of what that series is about, but time gives us room to go back and enjoy the things we love and to move forward.

Anyways towards the topic, if any game is remade it needs adjustments, small or large, to settle in and last longer. No point in bringing back the dead only to let it burn down fast.

And without looking at the article, I'm going to say it's fake. They have FF15, which has been on the production train forever. If they are going to talk ff7, to milk it, it'll be long after FF15. Besides, FFX and X-2 is on its way shortly, that'll hush that crowd (I'm in that crowd.)
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Re: Final Fantasy VII Remake: “It’s Happening,” Insider Says

Post by Count Mario on Sat Feb 22, 2014 11:35 pm

Um, I only meant to say that Dragon's flaw in her point is that Pokemon is one of the most successful franchises of all time and regardless of its genre of gaming, it'll still sell for years to come based on its popularity alone (not to say that it doesn't have the quality to back itself up). It'd be like saying platformers are still wholly relevant because Mario games still sell lol. I love turn based games, personally.
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Re: Final Fantasy VII Remake: “It’s Happening,” Insider Says

Post by dragonfire111 on Sat Feb 22, 2014 11:39 pm

well theres also persona being turn based. i was just trying to find some recent good selling TBRPG games to point out.
its a niche genre that i hope continues to live on (id be very sad it it went the same way CRPGs went years ago, though they are starting to return with kickstarter)
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Re: Final Fantasy VII Remake: “It’s Happening,” Insider Says

Post by BigBox on Sat Feb 22, 2014 11:44 pm

dragonfire111 wrote:oh and if turn based is outdated how is pokemon so popular
To be fair, it's a handheld game and people don't demand a lot of processing power from a handheld and turn-based gameplay doesn't require a lot of processing power.
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Re: Final Fantasy VII Remake: “It’s Happening,” Insider Says

Post by DP on Sun Feb 23, 2014 1:03 am

That argument doesn't really fit the conversation though. If a game isn't in HD or doesn't need the PS4's CPU, that doesn't mean shit about the genre it's in. We've had good FPS games on the DS, for example. Taking away credit due to a game or genre because it's on a handheld is a logical misstep. It can easily be reversed if I wanted to argue that the RTS genre is obsolete because it's not portable lol. I don't see the merit in "it doesn't need processing therefore it doesn't count," unless I'm misunderstanding your point in that post.

While there are action variants of many genres now, the slower variants still thrive. Turn-based strategy games are still huge despite Starcraft taking over for a while, the classic JRPG is still beloved by many even though some have flocked to the New Era ones, etc.
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Re: Final Fantasy VII Remake: “It’s Happening,” Insider Says

Post by BigBox on Sun Feb 23, 2014 1:11 am

DP wrote:That argument doesn't really fit the conversation though. If a game isn't in HD or doesn't need the PS4's CPU, that doesn't mean shit about the genre it's in. We've had good FPS games on the DS, for example. Taking away credit due to a game or genre because it's on a handheld is a logical misstep. It can easily be reversed if I wanted to argue that the RTS genre is obsolete because it's not portable lol. I don't see the merit in "it doesn't need processing therefore it doesn't count," unless I'm misunderstanding your point in that post.

While there are action variants of many genres now, the slower variants still thrive. Turn-based strategy games are still huge despite Starcraft taking over for a while, the classic JRPG is still beloved by many even though some have flocked to the New Era ones, etc.
To start, I wouldn't call it a strategy style of gameplay, because the gameplay style has no strategy.  There's a lot more strategy in a real-time game.  Anyway, my point is that I don't see the turn-based a legitimate form of gameplay to sit down and play on a home console for hours.  I see it as a way to play while on the go, because it's a good way to spend time.  On a handheld device I can see where it thrives, but on a home console for a game that you pay $60 for and to sit down and play.  It seems like a cheap way of grabbing at the gamer's money, because they're cheap to make.  Saying a turn-based game is worth $60 is like saying, Knack is worth $60.  Those types of games aren't worth $60 and usually do best on handhelds.
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Re: Final Fantasy VII Remake: “It’s Happening,” Insider Says

Post by DP on Sun Feb 23, 2014 4:09 am

"Cheap to make" is relative. Yeah, they don't need $60 million, but to be good they can't just be basic, minimum effort projects that have no depth. In fact, most turn based games have MORE depth than their in-genre action counterparts, specifically because the developers can nail down the basic structure quickly. Besides, being relatively cheap to develop does not equal a bigger profit because the bigger budget games are well known. GTA V's profit margin is, proportionately, infinitely higher than any Persona. But Persona's could and is likely higher than any game in the X and beyond FF games because of budget inflation - because Atlus focuses on depth with passable graphics here Square focuses on graphics with relatively low depth nowadays.

Speaking of Persona, it's the Vita's most successful game, at $60. So gamers find worth for it at a full price. Though I can't disagree with the notion that they fit handhelds more nowadays, because that makes sense. Except it's true for ALL RPGs. Why sit down to play a lengthy grindfest when you can do so on the go in short bites. Since every game nowadays is part-RPG, people can sit down to play the hybrids that have depth somewhere besides graphics, and go on a bus or train or whatever for the pure RPGs that have that depth. Handhelds are the best thing to happen to the genre, period. Not just the turn-based subset.

Lastly, whether or not you consider it strategic doesn't define whether or not it is. Play the endgame dungeon of Persona 3 and say you don't need strategy. You'll be lying through your teeth. Tell me FFVIII doesn't need some sort of planning before and during battles (a game where if you prepare wrong you'll effectively bomb your save file forever). I can go on for a while before I even acknowledge FFTactics's existence. To say turn-based RPGs don't require strategy is to say that Dark Souls is a JRPG. It's your own personal opinion, but it's one that doesn't make sense when someone brings a counterargument to the topic. (No, Dark Souls is not a JRPG because it's made in Japan. The "J" has been a misnomer for decades. That's entirely another topic though so if you wish to argue that, just pretend I said "Skyrim.")
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Re: Final Fantasy VII Remake: “It’s Happening,” Insider Says

Post by this_is_marko on Sun Feb 23, 2014 4:31 am

Anaconda_Vice wrote:
this_is_marko wrote:
Anaconda_Vice wrote:The classic turn-based is an obsolete play-style especially on console games. 

I actually really enjoy turn-based games
I'm sure you can agree that the style is obsolete regardless of enjoyment.

No.  No i don't haha
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Re: Final Fantasy VII Remake: “It’s Happening,” Insider Says

Post by BigBox on Sun Feb 23, 2014 5:09 am

DP wrote:"Cheap to make" is relative. Yeah, they don't need $60 million, but to be good they can't just be basic, minimum effort projects that have no depth. In fact, most turn based games have MORE depth than their in-genre action counterparts, specifically because the developers can nail down the basic structure quickly. Besides, being relatively cheap to develop does not equal a bigger profit because the bigger budget games are well known. GTA V's profit margin is, proportionately, infinitely higher than any Persona. But Persona's could and is likely higher than any game in the X and beyond FF games because of budget inflation - because Atlus focuses on depth with passable graphics here Square focuses on graphics with relatively low depth nowadays.

Speaking of Persona, it's the Vita's most successful game, at $60. So gamers find worth for it at a full price. Though I can't disagree with the notion that they fit handhelds more nowadays, because that makes sense. Except it's true for ALL RPGs. Why sit down to play a lengthy grindfest when you can do so on the go in short bites. Since every game nowadays is part-RPG, people can sit down to play the hybrids that have depth somewhere besides graphics, and go on a bus or train or whatever for the pure RPGs that have that depth. Handhelds are the best thing to happen to the genre, period. Not just the turn-based subset.

Lastly, whether or not you consider it strategic doesn't define whether or not it is. Play the endgame dungeon of Persona 3 and say you don't need strategy. You'll be lying through your teeth. Tell me FFVIII doesn't need some sort of planning before and during battles (a game where if you prepare wrong you'll effectively bomb your save file forever). I can go on for a while before I even acknowledge FFTactics's existence. To say turn-based RPGs don't require strategy is to say that Dark Souls is a JRPG. It's your own personal opinion, but it's one that doesn't make sense when someone brings a counterargument to the topic. (No, Dark Souls is not a JRPG because it's made in Japan. The "J" has been a misnomer for decades. That's entirely another topic though so if you wish to argue that, just pretend I said "Skyrim.")
I'm gonna keep the answers pretty short.

1. I feel like there's a lack of depth due to the turn-based gameplay, there's no pure control over the character at any pont in the game.  Everything is battle is pretty pre-determined and you can't control the character's movement.

2. I don't know an RPG that isn't a grind fest, but it's the RPG's with real-time gameplay that get the most attention in the console/PC space.

3. As for turn-based beholding any real strategy, I still strongly disagree.  But, most of my dislike comes from the fact turn-based games feel too much like boring flash games.  Also, doesn't an RPG have to be from Japan to be called an JRPG?  Considering that JRPG stand for, "Japanese Role Playing Game."
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Re: Final Fantasy VII Remake: “It’s Happening,” Insider Says

Post by dragonfire111 on Sun Feb 23, 2014 1:01 pm

Anaconda_Vice wrote:I'm gonna keep the answers pretty short.

1. I feel like there's a lack of depth due to the turn-based gameplay, there's no pure control over the character at any pont in the game.  Everything is battle is pretty pre-determined and you can't control the character's movement.

2. I don't know an RPG that isn't a grind fest, but it's the RPG's with real-time gameplay that get the most attention in the console/PC space.

3. As for turn-based beholding any real strategy, I still strongly disagree.  But, most of my dislike comes from the fact turn-based games feel too much like boring flash games.  Also, doesn't an RPG have to be from Japan to be called an JRPG?  Considering that JRPG stand for, "Japanese Role Playing Game."

1. you control their attacks and the actions they do in battle and predetermined are you crazy you manually select your attacks it doesnt do it for you
i find it hypocritical that you love ff13 but complain about turn based rpgs having no depth or control

2. just because you have to level up in rpgs doesnt make them grindfests for example in chrono trigger if you dont avoid the battles on the map you should be at the right level for the boss when you get to it

3. how they feel is subjective for instance i find FPS games a bit dull
and as for not having any strategy you mustve never played persona, golden sun, or chrono trigger

anaconda im sorry but you need to work on your arguments most of them boil down to "i dont like X therefore it must be bad and everyone else must feel the same way"
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Re: Final Fantasy VII Remake: “It’s Happening,” Insider Says

Post by BladedgeX on Sun Feb 23, 2014 1:05 pm

I think Pokemon is the better example out of the three. It's the only Turn-based RPG with it's own competitive scene.
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Re: Final Fantasy VII Remake: “It’s Happening,” Insider Says

Post by dragonfire111 on Sun Feb 23, 2014 1:09 pm

thats a good point too
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