8th Generation General Discussion

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Re: 8th Generation General Discussion

Post by DP on Mon Jun 30, 2014 11:17 pm

http://www.geekwire.com/2014/mario-kart-8-bigger-system-seller-titanfall-second-son/

MK8 is the most successful of the three next gen system sellers at actually moving more systems than the prior average.
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Re: 8th Generation General Discussion

Post by BigBox on Mon Jun 30, 2014 11:47 pm

Just wait for Uncharted 4.
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Re: 8th Generation General Discussion

Post by DP on Tue Jul 01, 2014 12:26 am

I've gone on record before saying I was completely wrong about Lost World selling systems. I'm assuming that comment is your way of backing down from the "MK8 won't sell systems" comments. And I accept that notion. 

Uncharted will probably push a shit ton of consoles, if U1 was any indication. (Probably to a greater extent due to the PS4's performance, and definitely to a greater extent if we get an Uncharted PS4 collection to give new fans a chance to play the series.) But that's not this argument. This argument was that MK8 would succeed, and that it would sell systems. It's done both, and better than the competition's system sellers did. 

But now that we've reached a neutral ground if not an understanding on that subject, we can drop it completely.
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Re: 8th Generation General Discussion

Post by DP on Fri Aug 22, 2014 4:24 pm

No links because I'm lazy. 

Ubisoft is pulling out of the Wii U market with mature games, but thinks that momentum will swing in its way. GameStop is putting a LOT of kind words out about the Wii U and Amiibo, which could mean they're planning a huge marketing push like they did with Skylanders.

Microsoft owes the US $29 Billion in taxes, which could affect the Xbox going forward.
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Re: 8th Generation General Discussion

Post by DP on Wed Oct 29, 2014 6:57 pm

News everywhere this week. 

Uncharted PS4 trilogy leaked by Sony on accident. 

You can get an XBO for $250 if you trade in a last gen console at a MS store. $350 otherwise until January. 

Nintendo is making a profit again, posting positive quarterly numbers for the first time since around 2010. The Wii U is up double year over year, the 3DS is falling (the New 3DS didn't launch by the time the quarter ended).
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Re: 8th Generation General Discussion

Post by Count Mario on Wed Oct 29, 2014 7:57 pm

You should reword that Uncharted sentence, I almost thought you meant a whole new trilogy was going to get made for a second lol.

Anyways, glad to see Nintendo is making a profit. Just try to get some heavy hitters to come out soon after Smash so all of the apparent miracle magic the Wii U's been yearning or doesn't fade away.
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Re: 8th Generation General Discussion

Post by DP on Wed Oct 29, 2014 8:19 pm

Whoops, that came up in the wrong order. Yeah, Uncharted 1-3 HD. Hopefully they port Golden Abyss too so I have absolutely no reason to even consider getting a Vita. 

As far as Nintendo goes, the U is selling at a profit now, that's all the difference really is. I mean the quarter's releases on the console were: Hyrule Warriors, a game that is performing decently above expectations but is clearly not moving systems. That and the residual impact of MK8 effectively turned a profit in spite of a falling 3DS. The clear shift is the profitability of the U, AND the train effect Nintendo tends to have the last generation or so: Slow to start but it doesn't stop when it picks up. 

That, of course, doesn't mean shit when we're talking about the 8th gen. The XBO is picking up as a primary console, meaning next year should be the time we start seeing the U really pick up as a secondary one. It's likely the XBO is in second by the year's end unless Smash slows the transition enough; by then the PS4 could hit 50% marketshare. The only factor that could change the gen's overall outcome is amiibo. But the good news of this profit shift is that we know Nintendo will be fine for sure by next gen, whereas both MS and Sony could and likely will pull out of the console market by then.
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Re: 8th Generation General Discussion

Post by BigBox on Wed Oct 29, 2014 9:04 pm

As far as Nintendo is concerned, they need to fire Iwata because the most successful time have had in years happened without him.  With him back at his job, if it wasn't for Super Smash coming out.  I would have expected these number to slump again.
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Re: 8th Generation General Discussion

Post by DP on Wed Oct 29, 2014 9:34 pm

You do know Iwata has been running Nintendo from home since the surgery right? Blaming Iwata for Nintendo's trouble, following the same path Nintendo has always followed, and then discrediting him for completely turning Nintendo into the modern gaming era in eight months is beyond illogical. It's like saying Microsoft should fire Phil Spencer because he hasn't turned around the Xbox brand in a year or that Kaz shouldn't be running Sony because he fucked up the PS3. 

That said, this particular shift in profits, OBJECTIVELY, has nothing to do with management, games, or anything else. It's literally JUST because selling the U at a profit makes a big difference alone, on top of building momentum painfully slowly throughout the past year. You will never see a quarter more perfectly neutral again in your life. No game launches until a week before the quarter ended, no major handheld releases in most of the world, a handheld that whose upgrade was announced halfway through the quarter (thereby killing sales), and it still turned a profit. There's nothing to credit or blame anybody for directly here. 

Of course I fully expect you to continue blaming him. I have no doubt in my mind that if he was the only person within 50 miles, and he saved you from choking to death, you'd somehow blame him for you choking in the first place lol
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Re: 8th Generation General Discussion

Post by dragonfire111 on Wed Oct 29, 2014 10:21 pm

i kindof want to see iwata doing the Heimlich maneuver on tsundere anaconda "psh its not like i wanted you to save me or anything baka"
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Re: 8th Generation General Discussion

Post by lpool1996moh on Thu Oct 30, 2014 5:58 am

O.o

Thank you Soo much for that image Dragon. Seriously I needed that. Pass the brain bleach. 

Seeing the U pick up is great, and with smash u, the new 3ds and a new pokemon game,  profits will only get better. 

Sony on the other hand, have nothing for the foreseeable future and Microsoft only have Sunset Overdrive and KI season 2, which ain't money makers.

Dps right, it could be Nintendo, Amazon and Google next gen, not Sony and Soft given how much they are losing still, company wide in Sonys case, soft just blames the One.
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Re: 8th Generation General Discussion

Post by BigBox on Thu Oct 30, 2014 6:26 am

lpool1996moh wrote:O.o

Thank you Soo much for that image Dragon. Seriously I needed that. Pass the brain bleach. 

Seeing the U pick up is great, and with smash u, the new 3ds and a new pokemon game,  profits will only get better. 

Sony on the other hand, have nothing for the foreseeable future and Microsoft only have Sunset Overdrive and KI season 2, which ain't money makers.

Dps right, it could be Nintendo, Amazon and Google next gen, not Sony and Soft given how much they are losing still, company wide in Sonys case, soft just blames the One.
Ehem... Bloodborne, Showtime, The Tomorrow Children, Guerrilla Games' Untitled RPG, Uncharted 4, Little Big Planet 3, The Order, No Man's Sky, Rime, etc.
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Re: 8th Generation General Discussion

Post by lpool1996moh on Thu Oct 30, 2014 9:19 am

And they come out when? Second quarter 2015 or there abouts? None of those bar Uncharted 4 and LBP 3 and maybe the order will pull in New systems.
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Re: 8th Generation General Discussion

Post by BigBox on Thu Oct 30, 2014 5:12 pm

My point wasn't when they were coming out, but that they're in the foreseeable future.
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Re: 8th Generation General Discussion

Post by lpool1996moh on Thu Oct 30, 2014 5:29 pm

meh i guess, but a bit too far away imo.
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Re: 8th Generation General Discussion

Post by DP on Thu Oct 30, 2014 5:35 pm

Don't forget BATTLEFRONT!

YAAAAAA-
But yeah Sony has a predicament because of the glorious support they gave the PS3 in its last year (and because of the Wii U effect this gen). Microsoft really has no excuse because the 360 was dead in the water the past three years. At least Sony's got some stuff in the pipeline though.

LBP3 is out soon though IIRC. And it's cross gen. That won't move much PS4 hardware honestly. Uncharted, with an HD collection? Next to Ratchet? And BF? Count me in by late 2015.
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Re: 8th Generation General Discussion

Post by DP on Fri Oct 31, 2014 1:24 pm

I'm gonna open the floodgates here. I'll end the coming discussion the moment it turns sour, but I may as well give it a shot. 

Who will have higher profits in fiscal 2014? Sony's gaming division (JUST their gaming division, i.e. PlayStation), or Nintendo? You'd assume the answer is obvious based on the massive PS4 numbers, but this quarter, SOMEHOW, Nintendo won. I'm honestly baffled by that fact. The PS4 outsold the U 6 to 1 from July to September, the 3DS sold just awfully, and the Vita, the VITA, outshipped the U. But Nintendo won. 

Now before I let this devolve before it even starts, Nintendo only won by about $20 million. But given the paltry fall lineup for the PS4 (all multiplat titles which are advertised under Xbox and almost all of them are cross-gen), I don't think that Sony can win if Nintendo even ships 1/4 of the PS4 in the holiday. (Shipping 2 million Wii Us shouldn't be hard considering they did that last year on 3DW alone.) This only comes down to the fact that the Vita will be dead in the water again now that the PSTV has shipped and bombed in the West and because the PS4 doesn't sell at a profit yet. Honestly it's entirely good timing that determines any of this, and this will likely never happen again unless Amiibo sells like crack. And I'm not even entirely convinced Nintendo can recoup the amount they're behind YTD (because, remember, Sony won Q1, meaning Nintendo would need amiibo to sell decently on top of high Wii U numbers and 3DS numbers at least 50% less than last year, for the rest of the fiscal year, to counteract Sony's overall lead.)

So to summarize:
Nintendo against the will of God won Q2 2014 financially. Everything was against it. I believe there's a 50% chance that Nintendo CAN (NOT will) edge out 2014 fiscally against the PlayStation division of Sony. 

Once we figure out Microsoft's figures I'll account for that but it's a safe bet that Nintendo is in second until at least a year from now with how unprofitable the XBO is (plus MS is selling at a huge loss with the current sales!).

Play nice.
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Re: 8th Generation General Discussion

Post by BigBox on Fri Oct 31, 2014 4:11 pm

This profitability that Nintendo has everything to do with their software and no their hardware.  And, even though it shows their hardware sells are in the hole.  The little profit that shows just means they didn't spend a lot of money on their hardware.  Then again, this is the company that pioneered the idea of "lateral thinking" in gaming hardware, so this should be no surprise.  If sales trends continue, I expect the X-Box One to take second place in console units sold and Sony will hold onto first as expected.
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Re: 8th Generation General Discussion

Post by DP on Fri Oct 31, 2014 5:40 pm

Generally you're 100% correct. But this quarter, software wasn't great. 3DS software was down despite Smash on Japan, and Wii U software was only average. Similar numbers since 2012 would mean that they should have profitted every quarter since then. The defining factor is that the U is now profitable per console. 

Also, financially, the Xbox brand will never take second (so long as Sony and/or Nintendo don't suddenly leave the market). They've never once made money from it. The XBO should outpace the U by the end of the year but they're really undercutting the cost to make each console.
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Re: 8th Generation General Discussion

Post by BigBox on Fri Oct 31, 2014 10:36 pm

I was talking total number of units sold when saying that X-Box will take second.  Of course X-Box won't take first place financially, the department in $3 billion in debt and not making any money.  Other then that, software for Nintendo sells have looked pretty good to me, but I guess I was wrong.  Smash on 3DS sold 2.4 million in a week, Mario Kart 8 sold a good million, or so units as well.  And, I know that the Wii U is selling at a profit and I gave why I thought it was selling at a profit.  I guess it's easy to to think that their software is doing great when you see those kind of numbers.  If any of that makes sense.
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Re: 8th Generation General Discussion

Post by DP on Fri Oct 31, 2014 11:08 pm

Oh yeah, I knew what you meant, I just wasn't sure if we were on the same page about the XBO. 

And Smash sold somewhere around 2 million first week worldwide, but it didn't launch in Q2 outside of Japan. (Though now that I think about it you have a point since they would have had to have shipped Smash worldwide by Sept. 30.) Smash accounted for 15% of 3DS software shipments alone for the past two quarters. Likewise, MK8 and HW make up half of the Wii U shipments since the fiscal year started. The 3DS is down quite a bit YoY in software, and it's only made up by the fact that MK8 is the sole reason for Wii U software increase YoY. So comparatively they're not doing much better than last year in software, whereas Sony is obviously up nearly 100% because of dual revenue off the PS3/4. That's what makes it really interesting to see that selling at a profit, alone, is making this difference. Question is now whether they keep the profit as-is or if they choose to abandon that for the sake of selling more units. 

After doing all this analysis I see why Nintendo always chooses underpowered consoles; they make their money back with no risk.
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Re: 8th Generation General Discussion

Post by DP on Mon Nov 10, 2014 3:33 am

The real 8th gen console war has begun...

Best Buy and Microsoft are competing to see who can sell the XBO for the lowest price! MS is at $249 with a trade-in, Best-Buy is at $199 with one (but it has to be a Slim allegedly - whether they follow that rule, who knows).

Nintendo actually has a problem now. It's not just cheaper, it's MUCH cheaper. They could either drop the profit margin and try to sell more units or keep doing their own thing and...well, honestly, profit regardless. But if the XBO keeps this price drop, Nintendo will need to either drop the gamepad or take a hit of $150 per unit soon.
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Re: 8th Generation General Discussion

Post by BigBox on Mon Nov 10, 2014 5:47 am

I hate to be that guy, but does Best Buy and Microsoft not realize that this kind of pricing to boost each other's sells is illegal?
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Re: 8th Generation General Discussion

Post by DP on Mon Nov 10, 2014 11:35 am

No it's not. This is the definition of capitalism. Best Buy is trying to drop stock because it's not moving, Microsoft is trying to push sales. The sales aren't even related really, since one's for the slim models of both 360 AND PS3 and the other is just a discounted upgrade. If that's illegal, so is GameStop having selling a game for less than Walmart and Walmart responding by dropping the price too.
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Re: 8th Generation General Discussion

Post by BigBox on Mon Nov 10, 2014 7:51 pm

Between Microsoft and Best Buy though to sell the X-Box One to increase sells and hopefully profits has Price Fixing written all over it.
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Re: 8th Generation General Discussion

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