Sly Cooper Discussion

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Sly Cooper Discussion

Post by Count Mario on Thu Apr 18, 2013 9:46 pm

I'm surprised this hasn't been made after Jak and Ratchet got threads, but whatever. I bought all four games, but have yet to play them due to being busy with the R&C Collection. But once I finish that, then it's onto Sly. Also, please put poiler tags if you're going to mention heavy spoilers from Thieves in Time. I really don't want to get spoiled.
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Re: Sly Cooper Discussion

Post by Shadowbhiemes on Thu Apr 18, 2013 11:46 pm

I like Sly a lot. They were my childhood games. Sly is my least favorite though. Awful story, ancestors overshadow the already under-used Bentley and Murray, they got rid of the previous game's cool cut scene looks (and replacing with generic looking flash crap) and the fates of certain characters just seemed poorly thought out. Carmelita is also horrifically ugly, and I think these were the least memorable bosses yet. The game is also even shorter than it's other games. All of that being said, it plays fine.

Now, I love Sly 2. It's just a damn good game. Sly 3 is about the same but slightly muddled by all the new minigames and characters. Sly one is classic platforming- too bad it's not terribly hard or long. It's also just nostalgic for me, it's really one of my first favorite games. Which is why Sly 4 is so bad for me- I hold the series to a really high standard.
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Re: Sly Cooper Discussion

Post by papertoonz on Fri Apr 19, 2013 3:43 am

Shadowbhiemes wrote:they got rid of the previous game's cool cut scene looks (and replacing with generic looking flash crap)

different devs different styles they weren't trying to be sucker punch they were trying to make a sly game

Carmelita is also horrifically ugly, and I think these were the least memorable bosses yet.

same as before different devs different styles but her model could of be more refined and i would say that the bosses were on par with 3

The game is also even shorter than it's other games

length should be a factor it about how the game uses the time it has look a journey it's a pretty short game but it gets what it need to be done in the time given same with portal

now to get on topic of which ones is the best and the answer is there isn't one if you look at the fan base you would see that it pretty split over which one is the best some people like the style classic platformer 1 had while other like the style of the heist 2 had there isn't one answer but IMO i think 4 got the best balance off sly to friends with the added ancestors but that's my own opinion on it. and don't ask me which one i like more cause i still don't know.

also count you shouldn't go making topics when you have nothing to add to the ATM
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Re: Sly Cooper Discussion

Post by lpool1996moh on Fri Apr 19, 2013 6:56 am

My favourite is sly 2,then 1 then 3 haven't played 4. Sly 2 felt like the most complete. And best story. Sly 1 was a retro experience and had by far the best boss in the series and most memorable villains. was just 2 with more annoying missions thanks too your team mates and a very bad villain/story.
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Re: Sly Cooper Discussion

Post by Count Mario on Fri Apr 19, 2013 8:21 am

Difference here is that I actually know a bit about the series and mainly made this so that other people could talk until i start playing the games myself, Paper. Besides, I never said that the discussion had to be about your favorite installment. You all just assumed that from the poll.

And lpool, I think you meant 3 for the last game you mentioned.
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Re: Sly Cooper Discussion

Post by papertoonz on Fri Apr 19, 2013 8:23 am

and why would you make the poll?
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Re: Sly Cooper Discussion

Post by Count Mario on Fri Apr 19, 2013 8:27 am

Well, since this is a Sly Cooper discussion thread, I figured that i might as well add the poll to be that question. Polls don't equal a whole thread topic, they're at least related to the discussion unless they're directly the same as the thread title and OP's purpose.
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Re: Sly Cooper Discussion

Post by papertoonz on Fri Apr 19, 2013 8:30 am

yes but by creating the poll with a question you ask the people who are gonna post the question which will stay in there minds once they start talking about the topic
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Re: Sly Cooper Discussion

Post by Shadowbhiemes on Fri Apr 19, 2013 5:00 pm

different devs different styles they weren't trying to be sucker punch they were trying to make a sly game
Correct, and Sly Cooper games have a distinct art style in cutscenes.
same as before different devs different styles but her model could of be more refined and i would say that the bosses were on par with 3
Being a different dev is no excuse to make over a character's design. You didn't see Bioware botch Sonic's design in The Dark Brotherhood rpg, right? The argument about "different dev doing their own thing" shouldn't apply because they're working on a series that has already established these things and there shouldn't be a need to change them. Maybe if there were like two Sly games, sure.
length should be a factor it about how the game uses the time it has look a journey it's a pretty short game but it gets what it need to be done in the time given same with portal
Mmm, not really. The villain's motives could have had more time to be introduced. He really sucked.
Another thing is that little advantage was taken of time travel. Sure we had ancestors but things like previous bosses, characters, and events and clockwerk could have been worked in.

I just think if Sucker Punch worked on it a much more amazing and realized product could have been Sly 4.

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Re: Sly Cooper Discussion

Post by PerfectCell21 on Fri Apr 19, 2013 5:31 pm

I played all 4 and loved them both with 3 being my least favorite

1 was pretty great loved all the villains and voice acting but it didn't give you the feeling of being a thief more of just sneak and kill

2 gave you the complete feeling of being a thief some missions got repetitive though and i feel like after 2 the over all villain quality got toned down which was why i disliked 3 so much 4 still had meh villains but they added a bunch of minigames and new types of missions so it kept me liking it they could had went more in depth with the whole time thing i expected more levels and sly to go back in time and see his dad.



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Re: Sly Cooper Discussion

Post by BladedgeX on Fri Apr 19, 2013 9:03 pm

One of the reasons I dislike Carmalita's design is due to the fact she does not perform a roundhouse kick like she did in the previous games due to her skirt. Otherwise, I liked the other character designs in 4.
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Re: Sly Cooper Discussion

Post by Shadowbhiemes on Fri Apr 19, 2013 10:08 pm

Agreed. Personally I've always wanted to play as Carmelita thanks to her awesome super jump, but Sly 3 only gave you a glimpse. It was really botched here in 4. I wonder why she's even usable in the field, she never has missions.
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Re: Sly Cooper Discussion

Post by Count Mario on Sat Apr 20, 2013 12:36 am

Well thanks for technically spoiling that my prediction that Clockwerk would be involved wouldn't happen, Shadow. what

Also, we aren't too sure that if Sucker Punch worked on it that it'd really be a Sly 4. I mean, look at what Naughty Dog was actually planning to do for a Jak 4 before they come up with The Last of Us and scrapped the garbage that they conceptualized. I really think that at this point, they've adapted to Infamous and are going to stay there for a while longer. All I can say is that if there's a Sly 5 (and I have heard that it's been hinted in a secret ending), hopefully Sanzaru fixes the flaws from Thieves in Time (although I can't judge it yet until I actually play the Sly games lol).
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Re: Sly Cooper Discussion

Post by lpool1996moh on Sat Apr 20, 2013 12:50 am

Count no spoilers but its like the mark of Athena ending. IT HAS TO BE FOLLOWED UP. Hints are subtle. This was no hint.
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Re: Sly Cooper Discussion

Post by Count Mario on Sat Apr 20, 2013 12:59 am

Oh, okay.Now I've got it.
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Re: Sly Cooper Discussion

Post by Count Mario on Sat Apr 20, 2013 5:49 pm

Shadowbhiemes wrote:
Mmm, not really. The villain's motives could have had more time to be introduced. He really sucked.
Another thing is that little advantage was taken of time travel. Sure we had ancestors but things like previous bosses, characters, and events and clockwerk could have been worked in.

Sorry, I just felt like correcting you here. After I recently spoiled myself to the secret ending,
Spoiler:
which has Sly awaking himself in Slytunkhamen's palace in the Ancient Egypt era,
I decided to dig up by researching bit more into the game without spoiling myself, and I found these videos.





Now if you read the spoiler I just put up, I am now damn positive that Clockwerk's going to show up in Sly 5 with an actual major role if Sanzaru put in so many hints and cameos. In fact, given the nature of the secret ending, we may even get to learn about his origins, how he came to despise the Cooper Clan, and be able to view his entire journey of jealousy and murder starting from the very beginning . So yeah, I'm pretty damn hyped for Sly 5 now. I used to think that Sanzaru missed a huge opportunity by not making Clockwerk play a major part in this game, but I really just can't conceptualize that they'd miss an even huger opportunity with what they've set up here.
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Re: Sly Cooper Discussion

Post by papertoonz on Sun Apr 21, 2013 1:51 am

god why do you guys thing they will go down that way, if they do they would fuck so much up if they did do that sly's father and mother would of never died and sly wouldn't of meet bently and murry and count that will never happen time travel is a touchy subject of which so many plot holes could come out of it heck the best way they could of dealt with it was not to bring it up at all which they did also those Clockwerk location are just easter eggs nothing more nothing less they aren't hinting at him playing a role in a future installment they are just easter eggs also Clockwerk's origins is already known right from the very first game so why would they need to bring it up again with the point they could easily fuck up the whole timeline

anyway now that my rant is over the sly collection just got rated for the vita so yeah another vita port incoming
http://au.ign.com/articles/2013/04/21/esrb-rates-the-sly-collection-for-playstation-vita?abthid=5173599fe4d9a6014c000009
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Re: Sly Cooper Discussion

Post by Count Mario on Sun Apr 21, 2013 2:32 am

Hey, I never said he had to be destroyed or anything like that. And of course I know that about time travel and how it could mess with the time continuum, I think me being one of the biggest comic book geeks in this forum made that obvious. All I'm suggesting is that it might connect to Clockwerk if Sanzaru hinted at this so much. They could easily come up with a story about why we might have to fight Clockwerk again or at least view his relationship with the family more. I mean, personally, I think these are a bit more than easter eggs considering they went as far as to place a sighting in every era and even make an item reference Clockwerk, not to mention the fifth game is going to have Sly stranded throughout time and have to find a way to get back. So it's natural that he might find opposition through fighting the one person who's pretty much lived throughout every era during his journey. I'm not saying that he'll get destroyed because yes, that will pretty much ruin the time continuum. I'm just saying that he could play a role, like being a recurring boss in the game considering how he mentions how he's fought with a bunch of Coopers and has constantly been beaten before: "You Coopers always find a way to beat me!" It doesn't need to happen, but I'd surely appreciate it. And just to add, I'm pretty sure that Thieves in Time technically made a bunch of plot holes in itself through history if the ancestors do remember these events somehow.


Seriously Paper, do you have a problem with me or something? No offense, but it seems like you sort of react in an opposing nature towards my suggestions sometimes and tend to undermine my gamer intelligence.
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Re: Sly Cooper Discussion

Post by BladedgeX on Sun Apr 21, 2013 5:03 am

Speaking of plot holes, why was Clockwerk at the "Cave of the Raccoon Clan" level? He couldn't be THAT old. And he couldn't have gotten THAT old for the robotic body. Or be angry as hell for no reason towards "Bob" to exact vengeance against the Cooper Clan at that time period. Who knows? Maybe Le Paradox met Clockwerk and made a deal? Or maybe Clockwerk was just stalking Sly and crew?
I also found something SUPER interesting on the wiki.

Hate Chip:
Power source of the Clockwerk Frame, the Hate Chip is what gave the
Clockwerk parts their seeming immortality. Once it was destroyed, the
Clockwerk parts rusted and decayed until there was nothing left. This
was the prime component in the Clockwerk frame that allowed Clockwerk to
survive with only his hatred as a fuel. It is also interesting to note
that the technology to develop something like the Hate Chip didn't exist
until things like computers were around, so how Clockwerk made or
obtained the Hate Chip in the first place is a mystery.

For all we know, it could be Sly's fault for Clockwerk's existence.

Spoiler:
Also, Le Paradox Boss battle was SUPER weak. I loved the idea of a rival gang, but the way that battle was handled was ass.
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Re: Sly Cooper Discussion

Post by Count Mario on Sun Apr 21, 2013 5:13 am

Actually, I was JUST thinking about that. Like, seriously. It could either be a slight chronological error on Sanzaru's part, Le Paradox having to do with it like you said, or Sanzaru might pull a Kessler by revealing that Clockwerk had originally time traveled to the past from the present time of around Sly's dad's death after constructing his cyborg self, and had the series' events set in motion from the beginning. Which pretty much made Sly Cooper the anti-hero that he is today unknowingly and already altered the timeline form the very beginning. The last theory makes sense considering the Hate Chip loophole, although it would really be just recycling Infamous' background plot.
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Re: Sly Cooper Discussion

Post by papertoonz on Sun Apr 21, 2013 5:58 am

ITS JUST AN EASTER EGG it means nothing, they were just referencing the fact he has lived since the cooper clan started and even if they went that route don't you think clockwerk wouldn't remember sly and kill him along with his father. anyway its still an easter egg nothing more nothing less it hints to nothing the devs even said it them self that they wouldn't go down that route because of how time travel would mess every thing up and also on the Thieves in Time stuff the earliest time period they go to is wild west which is about 1775 which is about 200 years away and besides it was mainly the cooper they met so they would just have to keep there mouth shut on it and nothing big would come out of it and besides that made that was how the time line was meant to play out in the long run mister comic book fan.

i also don't like how your doing this on all second hand facts which is what you do for most subjects you don't know that much of
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Re: Sly Cooper Discussion

Post by lpool1996moh on Sun Apr 21, 2013 6:55 am

Paper there's Easter eggs then there's that. They don't go to that much trouble and do nothing with it. An Easter egg is the clockwerk was Here graffiti. This is hints and build up. Exploring the many plotholes in his origin would be cool and as said he doesn't need to die. Think about how situational the fight was. Carmalita happened to bring a jet pack, the fight happened to be above lava and sly happened to have a route to clocks head. He is really hard to kill. So its very possible he doesn't die when you beat him. Also to show how wrong you were....they went prehistoric. Bob the caveman cooper. That's a little before Tennessee kid cooper. Also Medievil which is a bit before the wild west.

The secret ending and open plot points leave it open for a sequel and honestly unless le paradox breaks out clockwerk is the only one that makes sense. Who else knows sly was in Egypt? Not even his allies know. We know clockwerk was stalking slytunkahmen. Its the perfect set up. The point is the time travel plot is far from resolved and clockwerk is poised to make his move.
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Re: Sly Cooper Discussion

Post by Count Mario on Sun Apr 21, 2013 7:52 am

And to also add to the apparent plotholes, if you consider the fact how Bob and his era was actually created by Sanzaru themselves and not Sucker Punch form the previous games, there's also the higher chance that Sanzaru purposely purposely put him in to hint that there's more to Clockwerk's cameos than just happening to be stalking the Coopers normally as previously believed. So what I'm saying is they might have this even more planned that what we might think.

And personally, I take offense to your behavior. So just because I haven't played the games (although I have been playing Sly 1 recently to take a break from Going Commando and watched whole walkthroughs of the original trilogy months ago) means that I can't make speculation as a new fan? That's what makes it fun for me. Learning about new franchises and branching out. Getting to know about these Sony franchises beats sticking around with the usual Nintendo series I've sold my soul to. So really, just get used to it. If I really don't know much about these franchises like you're saying, then it should technically be just that easier to debunk my speculation.
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Re: Sly Cooper Discussion

Post by lpool1996moh on Sun Apr 21, 2013 8:02 am

Count I've played these series for years, trust me your theories are solid. Now get back to gc and no sleep until you beat it!
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Re: Sly Cooper Discussion

Post by Count Mario on Sun Apr 21, 2013 8:07 am

...Even when I've stayed up all day to 7:00 AM and still haven't slept?
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Re: Sly Cooper Discussion

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